Many different approaches to SSR + Translucency even in 4.8

Glitchlight_studios · May 15, 2015, 6:15pm

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18676107/reflectionsAndTranslucency.jpg

Glitchlight_studios · May 15, 2015, 6:57pm

Thanks! But I want it to be a flying VR game, so screen space reflections are pretty critical here =/

jstarrdewar · May 15, 2015, 6:37pm

Try using a reflection capture and adding an emissive channel to your translucent material. If your camera doesn’t need to move around too much that will work well. You can even blend between multiple capture cubemaps if you want to move around a little bit.

jstarrdewar · May 15, 2015, 7:03pm

There is a trick you could try — you can use a capture set to update each frame and then place it underneath the lake, the same distance below the water as you are above the water, with the same horizontal position. That will make the reflections line up. But I tried that on Senza Peso and found that the performance impact was too high.

Glitchlight_studios · May 15, 2015, 7:25pm

Ahh sounds like a very smart trick! But one of the goals is to keep the project as optimized as possible, in order to be able to rendered at 90 fps for VR, so a big performance impact scares me off =/

RyanB · May 15, 2015, 8:45pm

Hey guys, you could also hook up a SceneCaptureCube actor to a CubeRenderTarget texture and right click → create static texture, and then use that static baked cubemap on your lake using a material function. That is what we did on the Apple Zen demo since regular reflections were too slow. We had a material function called “distance limited reflections” to do this but for some reason it didn’t make it back to the main UE4 branch. Google distance limited reflections, its an easy function to make.

Re: the original question, did you make sure TemporalAA and realtime are both enabled? Those are both required

RyanB · May 15, 2015, 8:49pm

Sorry for the super long paste, but try pasting this into a material function in order to get the “Distance Limited Reflections” working. On mobile, we hooked the output of this function into CustomUVs to make it more affordable.

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Glitchlight_studios · May 16, 2015, 12:23am

Wow, what a support! I’m still very new in UE, so would be very happy to get some more detailed instructions on how to set up this material function and what to do with it =) Thank you very much for your dedication!

RyanB · May 18, 2015, 8:10pm

Sure, open the content browser and browser to a folder you want to put the function. Then go Add Nnew-> Materials&Textures-> material function.

Then simply paste all the nodes above. It should automatically create the inputs and output. Once you have done that you can drag this function into a material. The function should have inputs for the reflection center and radius and it should output UVs that you plug into your texture. Give it a shot and let me know how it goes.

RyanB · May 18, 2015, 8:12pm

Also, in terms of your original question about screenspace reflections, I have a hard time telling what is going on in your images. It looks like reflections are there just really feint. Can you try making the opacity 1 and the basecolor 0, roughness 0 and specular 1? That should rule out any other influences stomping the reflections.

Glitchlight_studios · May 19, 2015, 7:42am

Thank you Sir! I did paste it in a function and took that function into my material, but I think I’ve misunderstood the purpose of this function? Is it supposed to be a UV map for a HDRI map in order to fake reflections? (Where I for example can put that map in the emissive channel?) Or is it meant to do something with a set of cube capture maps perhaps?

It seems like my screen space reflections (when using translucency with SSR on) is very weak, even if I narrow it down to a black opaque ish material, - plus that the SSR seems to be limited in distance and angle.

I came across this thread: Glass material. Is it possible to get Transparency+Reflection? - Architectural and Design Visualization - Epic Developer Community Forums

Where Sitrec posted this:" I downloaded the Master branch a few days ago now and it has been added, as you can see in this very quickly thrown together test. It is simply a new checkbox option in the Translucency section of the material’s details panel." - YouTube

He seems to have both working SSR and Translucency.

Thnak you very much for your help and time!

RyanB · May 19, 2015, 5:56pm

It works with a single cubemap that you supply. It outputs UVs that you hook up into the cubemap texture sample.

The “Distance Limited” part means parallax corrected for a sphere shape. You give it a position in the world and a radius, and the entire reflection will be masked and deformed based on line traces to the inside of the virtual sphere.

plus that the SSR seems to be limited in distance and angle.

Yes, SSR can only reflect what is onscreen which is why it is important to have a cubemap via skylight or post process which gets used everywhere that the SSR ray goes offscreen.

Glitchlight_studios · May 19, 2015, 6:51pm

Thank you! I’ll try this for sure as soon as I’m able to. I don’t meant off screen though, compared to how the SSR works on a default lit material, it really seems to be wrong calculated on the translucent one, both the attenuation in energy - and blendingmode =/

RyanB · May 19, 2015, 8:34pm

Part of that is because translucent materials do not render depth, so the tempAA system cannot raytrace the scene from the correct point like it can for opaque. This means objects will be offset from where they actually should be since this is an approximation.

It may also automatically be taking opacity into account. Have you tried making opacity 1? Basically to compare I would make an opaque and translucent material where as many parameters as possible are the same between them. And the translucent one should be set to light as “Surface”.

Glitchlight_studios · May 19, 2015, 9:06pm

Hmm, not so easy to grasp that, does it mean that the translucent surface doesn’t have a “zDepht pass” and therefore cannot determine the amount it should distort/offset the reflection? I thought raytracing wasn’t involved in SSR, how does that work?

RyanB · May 19, 2015, 9:12pm

Yes that is exactly right. Yes raytracing is involved in SSR, that is how it knows where the reflection needs to go. It traces the ray from the camera and bounces it off the scene depth to get intersections.

Glitchlight_studios · May 20, 2015, 8:30am

I see! thanks for clearing that up =) But the Translucent mode in 4.8 does somehow seems to support this, since I can see some reflections here and there - they just seems to be very weak - which leads me to the thought that there must be something wrong in how the reflections are composed over the other channels?

RyanB · May 20, 2015, 5:52pm

Need to see a comparison shot of your weak reflections vs opaque ones that are as expected.

Yes some ray offsetting is expected but brightness should be the same.

Here is my test of 2 surfaces. Left is opaque, right is translucent.

In addition, the sheet closer to the camera on the right has opacity at 0.5 using vertex color:

both materials are the same except for the translucent one being translucent and “surface per pixel” lighting mode.

Glitchlight_studios · May 21, 2015, 6:29pm

I’m very grateful for your help!

Hmm this is weird, I did a blank scene and sat up a test, and the SSR’s seemed to be working fine! There was one problem though, the reflections where affected by the opacity. That kind of kills the whole idea with SSR on top of opacity =/ Here’s an example compared with vRay:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18676107/PublicWarehouse_2015/vRayAndUE4Reflections.jpg

I’m still having problems in my project though. I made the exactly same shaders, but something weird is going on =S Any idea of what’s happening here?

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18676107/PublicWarehouse_2015/UE4Reflections.jpg

BrianKaris · May 21, 2015, 6:45pm

Do you have Temporal AA enabled?